Messages posted by: NIC

It is with much sadness that we have to advise you of the death, on the 18th September 2018, of Ron Scott, Royal Engineers and No. 9 Commando.

Ron chose not to join any of the associations, but to live a quiet and private life, with his family looking after him in his later years.

The funeral is at 16:45 hrs, Friday, 5th October, at Parndon Wood, Crematorium, Harlow.

Our thoughts and condolences go out to all his family and friends.

The photo of Ron below is cropped from a photo in the No.9 Cdo Album in the Gallery.

Rest in Peace Ron.

Hi Brian,

Thanks for uploading the photos & record sheets to the Forum.
From these I can state that your father, although he was a Royal Marine, he was not a RM Commando. Not many people realise that up to 1942, there was no such beast as a RM Commando. The Royal Marines did not have a Commando Role until the first RM Commando was formed in 1942, there then followed a program of converting eight other RM Infantry Battalions to become RM Commandos.
Only RM Cdos wore the Green Beret - all other RMs wore the Navy Blue beret.
[It wasn't until the 1960s that all Royal Marines had been converted to become commandos that all, apart from Trainees, became entitled to wear the Green Beret as we see these days]

I've only had a quick glance but will study closer asap.
So your father was posted to 'R' S/L Battery (S/L = Searchlight) and then moved between a number of S/L Regiments.
You will notice the acronym L.U.C.A. as in 'Cease LUCA' & 'Commence LUCA'
The acronym stands for Living Under Canvas Allowance.
Another - MEF - stands for Middle East Force.

On 9/7/43 he is recorded as receiving the 1st Good Conduct Badge.

Other acronyms and abbreviations include R.M.T.G.D. / RM Trg Gp Devon - This is the RM Training Group, Devon.

M.N.B.D.O.

Here is a link to the RM Unit Histories which will help give you a better understanding of your father's time in the RMs and what each Unit did.
And then you can come back at us with all any questions that you may have...

https://www.royalmarinesmuseum.co.uk/sites/default/files/RM%20Unit%20Histories%201919-1997.pdf

Nick

The only other badge I can think of is an early No.4 Cdo badge -

Thanks Guy.
I could 'see' a sheep but thought it had irs head down. I'd looked at QRR but it didn't look right.
Great work, thank you again.

Nick

Hi Christophe,

I see now that you were not talking about a formation patch as I thought, but a shoulder title - the curved cloth badge at the very top of the shoulder...

I have not seen a SS Brigade shoulder title but I have seen quite dreadful reproductions of First Commando Brigade titles!

christophe wrote:Do you think the fighting units had the "commando" badge and the members of the HQ the "SS" badge?

The Commando units did have shoulder titles with 'Commando' on - but they were told to remove them before going into battle. Had they been taken prisoner wearing that title they would have been executed under Hitler's Kommandobefehl...
The term SS Brigade (Special Service Brigade) was dropped and replaced by Commando Brigade in December 1944.

The photo of the statue of Bill Millin has the Combined Ops badge facing the wrong way - the Tommy Gun should always face forward.

Nick

hi Pete, I meant Pat Churchill in my email the other day - but I put Frank - who is, of course, Pat's son...

Nick

Hi Christophe,

I think the badge you are talking about is a formation patch for the Special Service Brigade HQ...

see below:

Kevin, the badge you pictured is a Commando Association cap badge - not unlike the No.2 Cdo Officer's cap badge, the difference being the word 'COMMANDO' across the top.

Nick

Hi KH,

Again not my subject really but I had a quick look and came up with this information...

Nick

Pete,

Does James Thomas have any idea which regiment Bob Tout was in - his cap badge is certainly not that of the French Commando Troops - neither is that of the commando on the far right.

Greatcoats were not worn by commandos, however there are photos of Norwegian commandos wearing greatcoats at Westkapelle - the sergeant on the left isn't a French commando (cap badge) but it is just possible that he is a Norwegian commando.

Nick

Thanks Guy.

It amused me to see there was only Other Rank in the team - it reminded me of a young Flying Officer who was posted in to RAF Brampton when I was serving there in the late 70's.

This young officer, who eventually went on to achieve the rank of Air Commodore, decided that he couldn't join the RAF Brampton Cricket Team - as there Airmen (ORs) in the Team...

Nick

Hi Nina,

Once again, thank you for the photos - we know exactly what the memorial is! It's the 1 Commando Brigade Monument, Amfreville, Normandy. And as we do have some photos of it already, your father's photos will compliment them very nicely...

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/Commando+War+Graves+Memorials+and+Plaques/Normandy/

Just to clear up any confusion, there were four Special Service Brigades but, because the names were abbreviated to S.S. Brigades, it was decided to change them to Commando Brigades...

http://www.commandoveterans.org/SpecialServiceBde

Nick

Nina,

Thanks to the input of DannyL and Guy, I think it is fair to say that your father served within the Intelligence Section of 1 Special Service Brigade HQ.
A number of commandos who can be seen in the group photo with your father, can also be seen in other photos - which we believe to be of 1 Special Service Brigade HQ.

For comparison I have numbered the commandos in the group photo and include the links to the photos with some of them in...

#1 & #2 are in this photo
http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/HQ+and+Sigs/1+SS+Bde/Emmerson+photos/misc+je+photo+4.jpg.html

#6 is on the far left of this photo:
http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/HQ+and+Sigs/1+SS+Bde/Emmerson+photos/scan0092.jpg.html

With a bit more time and with closer scrutiny I'm sure we'll find more...

Nick

attached are two photos of a WWII Royal Signals cap badge - on the second photo I have'removed' the outer circle...

Nick

There aren't many clear photos of the cap badge but I think this one may give you a clearer idea...

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/HQ+and+Sigs/Signals+troops/Duffy.jpg.html

Nick

Hi Antoine,

I'm not an expert on insignia but as I understand it, during WWII some members of the Royal Corps of Signals took it upon themselves to 'adapt' the cap badge.
As you say, the brass outer circle was removed.

I attach a photo of the intact cap badge (King's Crown) and you can see that if the outer ring is removed there would be no scroll & motto...

I believe the current cap badge of Jimmy and scroll and motto (as you've included above) was introduced in 1946...

nick