Messages posted by: NIC

More photos of Cyril Pritchard and No.1 Cdo

Nick

Please can you include these photos in the No.1 Cdo album in the Gallery. They have been sent to me by Cyril Pritchard's grandson, Pete Aston
Cyril served in No.1 Cdo from it's formation until it was disbanded...

Nick

I've just been going through No.9 Cdo nominal roll and I noticed a couple of typing errors which need amending.
I have double checked both mine and Graham Cooper's masters just to be sure and they are both right.

McVlearie J. 2932647 Cameron Highlanders

should read: McClearie

MEewan W. 2990926 A & SH

should read: McEwan

MLiver E.M. 273196 RA

should read: McIver

Nick

Cooperclan29 wrote: ... my Great Uncle Eric Cooper... I am trying to find details of his war record but I am not immediate next of kin and do not have his Service number.

Hi,
You do not need to be the 'immediate' next of kin apply to the MoD for your Great Uncle's service record, the next of kin form has a table in which you indicate your relationship to the deceased and as long as you are a blood relative then that will often be sufficient; however, it is easier if you do have the consent of a closer relative...

Neither do you need his service number - as long as you have his date of birth...

Here are the links to the two forms you will need to apply:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/711147/20180524-request_service_details_NOK_part1_v6.2.pdf

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/545060/request_for_service_details_army_application_part2_1_.pdf

The MoD charge a one off fee of £30 and you will need to include a copy of his death certificate (available to order online from Gov.UK)

A word of caution, the MoD is the only custodian of WWII service records - do not waste your time and/or money with any other online genealogy sites that may claim to have his records - they do not!
They will simply take the information you supply them with when you start your search and feed it back to you - after you've subscribed to their site(s).

Nick

Pete wrote:the rank shown suggests that was his rank in the Commandos so where did he go when commissioned?

research suggests that he joined SOE, however, obviously it is difficult to confirm this without further investigation...

Nick

Please could you add the following details to the No.1 Cdo Nominal Roll

13111286 2nd Lieutenant Roderick Ellerman (aka Etzdorf), Pioneer Corps (334987).

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/36861/supplement/5941/data.pdf

Nick

Please can you add these two photos which include 6209980 Cpl William Doughty, (Princess Louise's Kensingtons), Middlesex Regiment to the No.1 Cdo Album - photos courtesy of William's son, John Doughty.
Can you also add his number & regiment to the No.1 Cdo nominal roll.

Thanks

Hi Craig

Craig wrote:Hi Nick

The following line on his service form reads:-

X68/45 33 RHU TO 38 RHU X(iv)A NWE 17/6/45.

Many Thanks for the help C

I'm not sure what the X68/45 stands for and it does depend in which column of the records it is in, but I would say it is the serial number of a routine order and the year of issue
The rest is quite straight forward -
33 RHU = 33 Reinforcement Holding Unit - possibly for The Wiltshire Regt.
38 RHU = 38 Reinforcement Holding Unit - possibly for the East Lancashire Regt.
NWE = North West Europe

101 Reinforcement Group was part of the 21st Army Group and was the HQ administering a number of Reinforcement Holding Units, usually three although more was possible, of which 33 RHU was one and 38 may have been another...
On 17 June 1945 he was posted from 33 RHU to 38 RHU [he was still on the X(iv) List] awaiting posting, as a reinforcement, to a suitable unit in NWE.

When he eventually did join his new unit in Europe, he was not posted as a commando - unless you have evidence that suggests otherwise?

Nick

Pete wrote:I would just comment on the statement that most commandos had a green chit pasted in the back of their paybook. I have checked and my Fathers does not have it and he was in No.2 Commando from formation to disbandment.

Pete, I am basing my information on years of research and the dozens of service records that I have read, deciphered and transcribed for countless people - not just one record.
I'm assuming that your father never got posted to X(ii) List, because of illness or wounding? In which case he wouldn't have had the green chit pasted into his pay book.

For Craig's granddad to be posted to X(iv) List (A), he must have been posted to X(ii) List beforehand...

Nick

Craig,

The entry in question reads:

Unit - No.3 Commando -- Posted to X(iv) List (A), 101 Rfn GP (Reinforcement Group) as valid Inf Rfn (Infantry Reinforcement) and Struck Off Strength.
Unit - 101 Rfn Gp -- Taken On Strength X(iv) A List

I have attached an explanation of 'X Lists' - you will see I have highlighted two paragraphs X(ii) and X(iv). As your family are adamant that he was wounded, he would have been posted to the X(ii) list - that should have been entered on his service record, but there may be an explanation why there is no record of his wounding... His main records would have been kept at the 2nd Echelon (well behind the front line), updates would be written on a different form (a small slip of paper), then sent back to the rear for his record to be updated. Often these updates got lost, or arrived out of chronological order!
When he was declared medically fit enough to fight again he would have been posted to the X(iv) list as a reinforcement. From there (and presumably on the next page of his record) you should see that he was SOS X(iv) list and posted to another unit where he would have been TOS...

What does surprise me was he was sent to a Infantry Reinforcement camp!
Most commandos had a 'green chit' pasted in the back of their paybook which stated: "This rank is a Commando and must be discharged to a Special Service Group Base Depot and NOT to a Base Reinforcement camp..."
The example I have attached was for 3 Commando Brigade in India/Burma, but the same normally applied to the other Commando Brigades in Europe and the Med.

I hope this helps but if you have more questions, please don't hesitate to ask - we're here to help.

Nick

Hi Brian,

Thank you so much for getting in touch.

YES, I, on behalf of the Commando Association, am very interested in any photos of 'Joe' Trevor - as you are aware he was very much a recluse in his later days and there are very few photos of him in existence!

I was in touch with his godson [who very kindly sent me a poor photocopy of a draft report entitled, 'Cliff Assaults' - which then became a Combined Operations Booklet - the copy was so poor that I ended up transcribing the whole report. I used an 'old font' and even put in his handwritten notes and amendments. Some of the photos in the report included some from the assault of Point Du Hoc] but he had no photos of Joe.

I have also been in contact with Ken Trevor's sons, Simon and Michael, but, again, no photos of Joe.

The Commando Association would also be very interested in a copy of the North Africa Campaign for the Website if that is possible? I am prepared to retype it if necessary...

Many thanks,

Nick

Hi Alexander,
Welcome to the Commando Website & Forums.

The only custodian of WWII Service Records is the MoD until they are opened to general public access at the National Archives.
Here is a link to the Gov.UK website which will explain how to apply.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/request-records-of-deceased-service-personnel

For information on No.4 Commando, go to our Home Page, scroll down the menu on the right hand side, click on 'World War Two', then click on '4 Commando' ...

For more information, see this thread in the Forum:
http://forum.commandoveterans.org/cdoForum/posts/list/0/1713.page#9556

Nick

Hi Craig,

Here is a link to James William Wilkinson, MM, whom I believe is the same person you described.
http://www.commandoveterans.org/JamesWilkinson3Commando

May I ask what your interest in him is - are you a relative ?

Nick

Hi,

We always encourage people to send in their photos.
Post your photos on this thread so we can have a look...

Nick

Craig, any hieroglyphics that you cannot decipher, get a good resolution scan and post them here and we'll try to decipher them... Not just one word though - include a couple of lines just so we can see the context...

Nick