No 2 Cdo Cap badge X 3 differing types

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 12/07/2020 09:34:39

Hi JB,

JB wrote:

May be the word " myth" is inappropriate.

I also do not doubt at all that the officers have also worn bullion sleeve patch on beret as also confirmed by Bishop and Buckmaster, I only have not yet seen a picture.

Yes the word 'Myth' is indeed very inappropriate, regarding the No2 Cdo capbadges, on this website.

You may be forgiven in that you never had the honour or privilege of meeting or even communicating with the late Lt Bob Bishop MC.
Had you enjoyed that privilege, as I was lucky to, you'd have realised what a phenomenal memory he had and what a stickler he was for detail regarding the Commandos. So you can be assured he would not have made any error in what was, after all, part of his own uniform as an commisioned officer in No2 Cdo.

Pete did post a link to 'No2 Cdo officers' in the CVA Gallery and even named three for you to look at, but you replied that you've never yet seen a picture - here are the links to each named officer's photo.

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/Joe+Nicholl/Lieut+JEC+Nicholl.jpg.html

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/Lieut+R+Bavister.jpg.html

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/Lieut+G+F+Whitfield.jpg.html

Nick

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 11/05/2012 08:27:13

Hi Nick,

Point taken, I greatly respect the late Bob Bishop and as said I do not doubt at all what he said. My only point was that I had also seen officers wearing single dagger without SS in the cva galery but this has now been clarified by Pete as pre green beret era.

As to the pic there may be crossed wires, I was referring to a pic of an officer wearing the bullion sleeve patch on the beret. It will for sure have occured as confirmed by Bishop ,but I had never seen a pic of this- and to be clear I am not doubting at all that this happened.

The pics on the links Pete kindly provided are very nice images of no 2 commando officers badges indeed.

I do sincerely apologize for an inappropriate word of 'myth'.

Cheers,

JB

NIC wrote:Hi JB,

JB wrote:

May be the word " myth" is inappropriate.

I also do not doubt at all that the officers have also worn bullion sleeve patch on beret as also confirmed by Bishop and Buckmaster, I only have not yet seen a picture.

Yes the word 'Myth' is indeed very inappropriate, regarding the No2 Cdo capbadges, on this website.

You may be forgiven in that you never had the honour or privilege of meeting or even communicating with the late Lt Bob Bishop MC.
Had you enjoyed that privilege, as I was lucky to, you'd have realised what a phenomenal memory he had and what a stickler he was for detail regarding the Commandos. So you can be assured he would not have made any error in what was, after all, part of his own uniform as an commisioned officer in No2 Cdo.

Pete did post a link to 'No2 Cdo officers' in the CVA Gallery and even named three for you to look at, but you replied that you've never yet seen a picture - here are the links to each named officer's photo.

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/2+cdo+officers/Lieut+JEC+Nicholl.jpg.html

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/2+cdo+officers/Lieut+R+Bavister.jpg.html

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/2+cdo+officers/Lieut+G+F+Whitfield.jpg.html

Nick

Attached is an early No 2 commando officers badge out of my collection that I would like to share.

Cheers,

JB

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 11/05/2012 10:00:49

With all due respect guys as the opening post to this thread demonstrates there clearly are a lot of 'myths' surrounding this subject!

Maybe I'm reading this in a different light but I can't see that there was any disrespect or doubts shown towards any veterans here and can't help but feel there is a bit of an over-reaction?

There sure are many uncertainties surrounding the insignia in 2 Commando and no-one is suggesting this is being perpetuated by veterans, most of it is by dealers with something dodgy to sell!

Paul

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 11/05/2012 10:38:42

In my original reply one sentence simply stated "your use of the word "Myth" was an unfortunate one in the circumstances" . Those circumstances being that it was mentioned on a public forum in the same context and message as the statement made by two Commando Veterans. That could and did lead to misunderstanding as to what was being said, or inferred. JB has now clearly answered that point certainly to my satisfaction. It is only right and proper that at times comments are questioned and clarifications asked for and that has been done.

As to reactions or over reactions, all I will say is that this is the Commando Veterans Association website which has Veterans and families of Veterans who monitor what we write. In that respect it is unlike many other public forums. There will be times when comments have to be questioned, and misunderstandings have to be clarified. We have a duty to those Veterans who have shared so many of their memories and their personal information with us to do so. Passions will naturally run high, and even higher if we did not.

JB I would like to thank you for clarifying your comments and I fully accept everything you said in your clarification. Hopefully we can move on back to the subject of the 2 Cdo cap badge now.

Nice picture of the early badge JB, and Lindsay I am so sorry to hear you have lost your Dad's original badge.

In the interests of moving things on, here are some 2 Commando insignia mysteries that always puzzle me:

1) ORs wore a white silk on black felt version of the SS badge on both of their sleeves up to late 43. There must have been hundreds more of these made than the officers' bullion version, but I don't think I have ever seen an original surviving example (with provenance), yet the bullion version is quite common? Where are they all?? I've seen some claimed to be original but these do not look like the ones in the wealth of photographs.

2) The famous black and white lanyard, what is its origin? A vet once told me it was a battle honour but I have seen nothing to substantiate this? Who introduced it and what for??

Cheers
Paul

I have checked the album of No.4 Independent Coy and see that the officers are not wearing lanyards as can be seen in this excellent photo. Most went into 2 Cdo when it was formed:

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/WW2/Independent+Companies/4+ind+coy+1940+copy.jpg.html?g2_imageViewsIndex=1

Almost immediately No.2 Cdo is formed they are wearing lanyards as can be seen here in these early photos:

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/Lt_Col__Newman_VC.jpg.html

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/5+troop/5troop588.jpg.html

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/5+troop/dad+and+others590.jpg.html

Their CO on formation was Lt Col. Newman of the Essex Regt. Now the Essex Regt did have lanyards and I wonder whether it was, along with the other insignia and dress they adopted, just to give them their own identity and make the new No.2 Commando unique. JB recently posted a photo of a 2 Cdo lanyard he had acquired. These are very hard to find nowadays.

This forum thread has made me look through our 2 Cdo gallery and realise just what excellent photos we have in there. I have always liked the pre St Nazaire training photos located here:

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/training/

who would want to be facing this attack (a good example of the white gaiters as well) :

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/training/2+Cdo+trng.jpg.html

October 8 2010 019.jpg

Great pics indeed I always love to browse through the gallery.

Another interesting habit of no 2 commando appears is that you often see that on the shoulder title the letters "No." is cut off or folded down so simply showing "2 commando" instead.

Cheers,

JB

Hi JB

I hadn't even noticed that before but my father's is the same and looking through the gallery most appear without the No. :

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/2/5+troop/joe+rogers/Insignia+and+Medals+of+Joe+Rogers+MM+copy.jpg.html