Brian Kelly, No9 Commando

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 09/09/2013 17:13:19

Hello, I would like to find out more about my husband's late father, Brian (or Brien) Kelly.

We believe he was in 9 Commando because of the places he mentioned he visited during WW2 (e.g. Gibraltar, Italy, Africa, Greece (Kithira), Albania - although not necessarily in that order. I have read the excellent history of 9 Commando on this site, but would love some tips about how to trace Brian's war service. I have contacted the Army Personnel Records but, as you will know, there is a very long wait. Is it possible I could find anything in the National Archives, or will they just have war diaries etc, rather than anything on individuals?
I would be very glad of any help. :D
With thanks,
Midge Gillies

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 06/09/2013 18:17:56

Welcome to the forums Midge,

You have made a good start by applying for Brian's service records.

I guess you looked at the troop photos in the No. 9 gallery, on the off chance you might spot Brian ?

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/9/

Would you have any Commando related photos of Brian you could share with everybody, perhaps they might be added to the No. 9 gallery, if that is indeed a Commando Brian served with. It would be great to put a face to a name, and will serve as small tribute to Brian.

I'm heading to the National archives soon, I was hoping to go last month, but it never happened ;-( So I'm biased in agreeing with you that you should go.

The very best of luck !

Thank you for your prompt reply and welcome. Yes, we've been poring over the photos - one looks possible. And I will certainly be adding some photos to the gallery.

I've been to the National Archives for other research (my dad was a POW) and know how fascinating/daunting they can be. Is it possible to find records on individuals there?

Thanks, again, for your encouragement.
Best wishes,
Midge

Hi Midge,

To be honest the best route for finding out about your late Father-in Law's service is via his Service Records from the MoD.
It is a long wait, I know, but it is worth it and it is the most reliable source of information about his service and imakes a good frame on which to start building the bigger picture.

The National Archives don't have records on the individual, only War Diaries of the different units.
The content of the War Diaries varies greatly and it very obviously depended on the individual tasked to compile them - some are full of detail of day to day occurances, others are very sketchy with very little info...

What most of them do have in common, however, is that OR (Other Ranks) are seldom mentioned by name, whereas Officers are.

During my research, I have looked at and copied some of No9 Cdo's War Diaries and I have had a quick look at those today. Unusually, in one of them there is a partial nominal roll - but I couldn't see your father-in-law's name there.
Of course that doesn't mean that he wasn't part of No9 Commando - there was no official definitive Nominal Roll for those who volunteered for Commando Service and we (the CVA) are still trying to compile Nominal Rolls for each Commando Unit, but it is long and time consuming and open to many pitfalls...

That is why the Service Records are so important - please be patient!

Please feel free to ask any questions you may have and if there are any of your father-in law's anecdotes that you can share, you may find it triggers something. No matter how trivial you think the information is, you'll be surprised what box of treasures it could unlock...

Nick

Dear Nick,

Thank you VERY MUCH for such a helpful reply and for checking the nominal roll. I will wait to see what the MoD sends when it's ready.

In the meantime, I have been following your advice. I have been quizzing my husband about what he remembers his father saying about the War. We also went through some old photos and I will post a few when I have a minute. Many of them have dates and a few names on the back. So this is all helpful.

Brian Kelly died in 1983 but my husband, Jim, went to a few reunions and remembers the names of some of the veterans he met who served with his father: Jack Muir, Jimmy Wham (who later ran an icecream shop in Largs, Scotland, we think) and who was awarded the MM, Jack Quarrie (I've spotted the photo of him sent in by his son). Jim also recalls meeting a veteran who gave him a book on economics that he'd published when he was at an American university. Jim thinks he was called Bill Balfour, but I can't find his name on the internet.

Again, thank you for all your help.

Best wishes,

Midge

Hi Midge (and Jim),

I'm pleased to hear that trawling the depths of Jim's memories has started to turn up results.

Jack Quarrie was, of course, an RSM (Regimental Sergeant Major) with No9 Cdo - so it would certainly point to Brian Kelly having been in No9.

I will look for the other names in the nominal roll that I have...

Sadly, Jack Quarrie passed away in 2010 after a short illness.
He was a well known and iconic figure as the Parade Marshall at the Remembrance Services held at Spean Bridge Commando Memorial every November.

I do have a list of National Archive reference numbers for the War Diaries & Documents relevant for No9 Cdo should you want them?

Right, your task now is to keep on at Jim and try and glean more snippets of info from him whilst I work on what you've already given us...
The photos you mentioned are always welcome and, again, may hold that hidden clue (the names on the reverse could help too).

I see you're also in Cambs - I'm in Godmanchester and would be happy to meet up with you & Jim if you want to chat over any thing.

Nick

Hi Nick

I sent Pete ten photos this afternoon; a few have names (?Podge? crops up quite often), places and dates on the back. They?re taken in Athens (1944), Poros and, right at the end of the war, Rome.

Jim spoke to his older brother last night who came up with two new names: Jackie Allen (Southgate Olympic FC) and Bob Salmon (Teddington). Jackie was shot through the nose standing next to Brian Kelly, but, fortunately, survived.

We would love to meet up some time, thank you.

Best wishes

Midge

Further to my previous reply, I have the following info regarding the other names:

3065655 Cpl J. Wham, 2 Troop, No9 Cdo; Royal Scots Regt.

2884648 Pte W. Balfour, 4 Troop, No9 Cdo; Gordons.

14554594 Pte J. Muir, 4 Troop, No9 Cdo; Cameronians.

this info was taken from a partial nominal roll found in a file in the National Archives - WO 361/861 ITALY: NO 9 COMMANDO; MISSING PERSONNEL; MISSING PERSONNEL.

Neither Jack Quarrie nor Brian Kelly are listed in this nominal roll and, despite the title of the document, none of the names listed on this particular nominal roll were listed as missing...

Nick

That's fascinating. Thank you!

3313201 Pte J Allen, HQ Troop, No9 Cdo; Highlands Light Infantry.

have you had a browse through the Reunions Album in the Gallery - here is one of No9 Cdo taken in 1962

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/Commando+Gatherings+pre+CVA/reunions/Commando+Reunion+1962/No+9+1962.jpg.html

nick

Yes, he's there in the front row with his legs crossed! Jim was thrilled to see the photo. Thank you!

Photo updated accordingly!

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/Commando+Gatherings+pre+CVA/reunions/Commando+Reunion+1962/No+9+1962.jpg.html

:D

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 09/09/2013 17:28:50

Jim was thrilled to see the photo. Thank you!

I know the feeling !What a wonderful site this is ! I look forward to seeing the new pictures.

Well done Nick, as always ;-)

Hi Midge,
Not a lot of information,but perhaps help confirm that Brian Kelly was in No 9 Commando.

In the old Commando Association Newsletter No 78,,dated March 1984 there is the following reference under Obituary

Sgt Brian Kelly of Barnet, Herts,

I hope this reference is for your Brian Kelly

Regards

Graham.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 09/09/2013 20:29:38

It's marvellous that a photo was found. :)

Just wondering ... if anyone with an interest in No.9 looks in here, perhaps names could be put to these men?

http://gallery.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/4/Commandos+-+Troon.jpg.html?g2_imageViewsIndex=1

Ahem .... it's the one taken in Germany, after the War, with No.4 and No.9 Commando.