Messages posted by: Rob_Crane

Final two images ...

Penultimate post.

Three more ...

Three more images.

Thursday was a very enjoyable, and at times quite emotional, day. We were honoured by the presence not just of COPP veterans and Countess Mountbatten, but also General Sir David Richards (Chief of Defence Staff) and Major General Ed Davis (Royal Marines), plus representatives of the SBS. The event was marshalled by troops, at least some of whom were I think from 24 Commando Regiment Royal Engineers (their fatigues included the commando dagger on an olive-green background).

The event started with a speech by General Richards before Countess Mountbatten spoke about her own time with Combined Operations and the importance of the work that COPP did. She then unveiled the memorial plaque, before the memorial was dedicated and wreaths were laid. Major General Davis then stressed the importance of the COPP legacy to the modern-day SBS, and the event rounded off with COPP veteran Jim Booth adding his thanks and some recollections.

The veterans, their families, and current service personnel then went for a meal at Hayling Island Sailing Club, where COPP was based during the war.

It was a wonderful day, and I was particularly pleased to speak with veteran John Ashford who remembered flying out to join COPP in the Far East (he was a replacement for another Royal Engineer who had been killed in action) and being met at the airport by my Grandfather (then senior Engineer COPP officer in the Far East) who promptly said: 'Let's go for a drink.' (One thing that Major General Davis stressed in his speech was that the drinking element carries on in the modern-day SBS!)

Although the memorial's up, they're still seeking funds in order to help maintain it - see http://www.coppheroes.org/donate.htm

The COPP veterans in attendance were:
- John Ashford (Royal Engineers)
- John Ainsworth-Davis (COPP HQ intelligence staff)
- Jim Booth (Royal Navy)
- John Bowden (Royal Navy)
- Roger Gilbert (Royal Engineers)
- David Owen (SBS)
- Peter Palmer (Royal Navy).

Unable to attend were:
- Logan Scott-Bowden (Royal Engineers)
- Nick Goodyear (Royal Navy).

There's a BBC TV report here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-19749291

And a report on the Royal Navy website: http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/News-and-Events/Latest-News/2012/September/28/120928-COPPS

As mentioned, I'll put some of my photos here - unfortunately my view wasn't the best!

Hi Mark

My Grandfather kept in contact with some of his COPP colleagues after the way, and so it was always fairly well known in the family that he was in the unit. It's only in recent years that I've really started delving into it in more detail, though, and have now got his service record, too, plus a few other little things that he left.

Rob

Incidentally, while I'm here, does anyone know where I may be able to find out details about Naval Parties? COPP were predominantly a Royal Navy unit, and when travelling on troop transports they did so in the guise of a Naval Party (apparently to help avoid arousing suspicion). My Grandfather's unit is widely listed in secondary sources as Naval Party 750 but I have a hunch it was actually Naval Party 755 and would like to try and pin this down a bit.

Think I'm right in saying that, within SEAC (South East Asia Command), COPP, Sea Reconnaissance Unit and RM Detachment 385 were all subsidiary units of the Small Operations Group (along with some SBS units). Main camp was Hammenhiel Fort in north west Ceylon/Sri Lanka. This location was apparently originally found by Geoffrey Hall, a COPPist who was in the first COPP party out in the Far East; set up initially as a COPP base and run on fairly informal grounds, it seems according to his autobiography they got a bit miffed when 'senior ranks' started arriving and running things in a more 'army-like' fashion!

(Hall later rose to Rear Admiral and became the Hydrographer of the Navy.)

Edited to add: seeing as you've found the COPP Heroes website, might as well link to my Grandfather's profile! http://www.coppheroes.org/individuals/crane-j.htm

I'll try to remember to post any decent photos that I take here, if that might interest people?

I've just received my grandfather's service record - lots of it!

There's an intriguing page that lists his training, including that after he joined COPP.

14-19 August 1944: aerial photo reconnaissance course at RAF Medmenham
21 August-9 September 1944: navigation course, HMS James Cook (Combined Ops landing craft etc.)
10 September-18 October 1944: 'COPP training course' Hayling Island

I am intrigued on two counts:

Firstly, there is no record of him attending Achnacarry or Ardentinny or wherever to get a green beret, yet we have his 'COMMANDO' shoulder flash. 14 August is immediately after he transferred from his Royal Engineers Training Battalion to join COPP. I guess he might have attended as part of the 'COPP training course', or maybe even afterwards as they did not sail for the Far East until early November 1944.

Secondly, there is mention of a 'mud course'. The handwriting is somewhat hard to decipher, but it seems to put the location as 'COXE, Marwe, Bombay', and it's under the authority of the Small Operations Group (which COPP operated under in the Far East). Yet the date is 10-15 August 1944, which is both when he was in the UK and straddles his pre-COPP time and the time he was on the photo recce course - so I suspect it was some other time and somebody has written down the wrong date, possibly 1945 as they were in/around India at the time.

Always the way: some questions answered, other questions raised!

Edit #1: intriguingly, it also suggests that he was a trainer on the COPP training course in Sept/Oct 1944 - I guess passing on his fieldworks expertise as that was his speciality at his TBRE. I guess it's possible to learn some things at the same time as teaching others!

Edit #2: Regarding the mud course, I suddenly thought, 'Hang on, if it was in 1945 then it'll be in his diary' - and there it is! "Started course on mud. Feel that much of it is a waste of time."

Thanks for mentioning this - I wasn't aware of the series, but am now!

It's also available to watch on demand at http://www.channel4.com/programmes/commando/4od

Meridian Tonight, local TV news for Portsmouth, had a piece about Combined Operations Pilotage Parties (COPP) on their show tonight, including an interview with veteran Jim Booth which I think was conducted on Hayling Island (where COPP were based). If you are interested, you can see it online at: http://www.itv.com/meridian-west/wartime-secret73788/

Only had a chance to skim read it, but there's what seems a good overview of the SSRF at:
http://www.combinedops.com/SSRF.htm

Edit to add: And someone recently discussed on here was also involved with them, apparently: http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoForum/posts/list/2902.page

Many thanks for those links, Geoff. COPP seems to be getting a bit more publicity lately thanks to that memorial appeal. There are, so far as we're aware, three surviving members of COPP:

? Major General Logan Scott-Bowden, Royal Engineers, who went on to have a distinguished post-war military career - he was one of the men who crawled over the D-Day beaches ahead of the invasion and then manned the marker X-craft on the day.

? Lieutenant Jim Booth RNVR, who also manned a marker X-craft on D-Day and then served in SEAC.

? Corporal David Owen, SBS, who was out in SEAC.

A similar photo is included in an edition of Life magazine that's online:

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=_0kEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA38&lpg=PA38&dq=HW+Goulding&source=bl&ots=nZP-LvnX0k&sig=WkdIMrJm54L3WAUGHrjiybimRVE&hl=en&ei=_BcBTrjYIYPQhAeX1rWMDQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=
3&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=HW%20Goulding&f=false