5 Btn Royal Marine

Could anyone please tell me why My Late Father would have gone to Siera Leon on the Princes Beatrix in 1940 when he was in 5th Btn Royal Marine's before he became a 45 Commando ?.

Was this part of his training or was it something to do with the war?.

Hi Iris

In November 1941, HMS Queen Emma and her sister ship, renamed HMS Princess Beatrix, together with HMAS Dunedin, were at Freetown, Sierra Leone, where they had paused on their way back to England after carrying troops to Egypt. On receiving a report that a surface-raider had been spotted off the west coast of Africa, the three ships were ordered to join in with other warships, both British and American, to help in the search which proved to be unsuccessful. The surface-raider was later identified as being the Atlantis.

Does this fit into your research so far?

Regards

John M

Hi John.

Thankyou for your reply, sadly I'm not sure your information helps me.

According to my Dad's records he left liverpool with 5th btn RM on the 31st Aug 1940 and arrived Ftreetown on the 14th Sept 1940.
He then left Freetown on 20th Sept 1940 and returned to Freetown again on the 28th Sept 1940, finally leaving Freetown on 6th October 1940 and arriving Gibralter on the 15th Oct 1940. he then left Gibralter on 18th Oct 1940 and arrived Glasgow area on 27th Oct 1940.

I hope this makes sense.

Regards
Iris

Hello Iris

Yes ........the RM's history is not a strong point of mine. My Dad having been an Army Commando

But if I were looking into this it may be worthwhile to trace the Princess B's history and then try and tie it in with what you know about your Dads record.

Maybe a RM researcher can help.

regards

John M

Hi Iris, are you sure the Princess Beatrix was the ship your dad sailed onto Freetown on 14th Sept. 1940, and was it Princess Beatrix that he sailed back on ?

The wikipedia article, which of course could be wrong says the ship was being converted in Belfast from Sept. 1940 to Jan 1941

In September 1940 Prinses Beatrix was formally taken over by the Admiralty to be converted into an "assault ship" at the Harland and Wolff shipyard in Belfast

and

The ship was commissioned as HMS Princess Beatrix on 22 January 1941

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Princess_Beatrix

The source for this Wikipedia article is here, with more photos.
https://sites.google.com/site/hmsprincessbeatrix/scratch-built-model-of-hms-princess-beatrix/service-history-m-v-prinses-beatrix-and-koningin-emma-1939---1968

Given the dates from Iris it took 15 days to sail from Liverpool to Freetown, arriving on the 14th Sept the ship could have sailed back to the UK in 15 days to still fit in
with the September date. But I'm only speculating and as John says finding the log of the HMS Princess Beatrix would clear it up.

To add some more colour to the story, seems it was rather risky entering Free town harbour, not least because of

3 unexploded depth charges are in position 08 degs. 32' N. 37 degs. 35' W.

http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/extras/index.html?src.php~exmain

This thread relates to James King of 5 Btn Rm and 45 Commando
http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoForum/posts/list/3649.page#12717

This is an interesting site for finding war diaries on Royal Navy ships and operations they took part in, including Commando operations and casulaties. http://www.naval-history.net/index.htm

A search for HMS Princess Beatrix on the site returns 3 pages of results.
http://www.google.com/cse?cx=009877456310598106759%3Azxs0-uu4kew&cof=FORID%3A0&q=princess+beatrix&sa=Search#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=princess%20beatrix&gsc.page=1

Not so related to Iris's question but of use to others

A search for Commando on the site returns lots of results
http://www.google.com/cse?cx=009877456310598106759%3Azxs0-uu4kew&cof=FORID%3A0&q=princess+beatrix&sa=Search#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=commando

Hi Mark.

I'm very confused now as Dad's records say's he Embarked Princes Beatrix, Pem Dock 29.6.1940 and arrived S Fort 9.7.1940.

The records don't say which ship he sailed on for the trip to Siera Leon, I just presumed it must be the Beatrix as this was the one he had sailed on 2 months previously.

Regards
Iris

Jotting some notes in a rush - recalling Dakar Operation
The following bullet points come from 'By Sea By Land' by James Ladd - Appendix 4 Page 477 and pages 61-63

5 Bn RM - formed 2/4/1940 at Cowshot Camp (Brookwood) Hampshire - CO - Lt Col HE Reading
Part of 101 RM Bde
Advance party to Hayling Island for Boat Training but Bn began to move to Tenby S. Wales on 19 June.
In August - embarked in the transport 'Karanja' for the Dakar Operation and sailed to Freetown
Returned to Scotland in late Oct - where carried out exercises until June 1942.
In Feb 1942 Lt Col S G Cutler became CO
Bn moved to Ystrad in S. Wales on 8-9 June
2 Sept Lt Col K Hunt became CO
Some companies returned to Scotland for amphibious training in Nov/Dec
These Companies, and those in S. Wales were assembled at Hursley (Hampshire) from 12 Dec 1942
Aptil 1943 moved to Ryde Isle of Wight
29 May moved to Burley (Hampshire)
Disbanded ealy Aug 1943 - HQ and most personnel were reformed as 45 (RM) Cdo

The Dakar Operation - see Arthur J Marder 'Operation Menace'. In summary an abandoned expedition against Vichy French.

See also earlier proposed use should Germans invade Ireland and also readiness for Operation 'Accordion' and Operation 'Sackbut' against Azores and Cape Verde Islands i.e. planned prior to 'Menace' should Spain join the Axis

This provides an outline for further research, no doubt further links can be found on the internet.

Regards and hoping this helps
Mike Beckett

Hello Mike and Thankyou for your information.

I sent an email to the Royal Marines Association yesterday before I received your message asking if they could help with my research.

This is the reply I received this morning:

5 Battalion, part of 101 RM Brigade, took part in Operation MENACE, at Dakar, Senegal, at the dates you give. There is no shortage of information on this operation eg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dakar

Mark Bentinck FRHistS

Royal Marines Historian, Naval Historical Branch, No 24 Store, PP20, Main Road, HM Naval Base, Portsmouth, PO1 3LU.

Civ Tel:02392 720010. Mil Tel 9380 20010. Fax 02392 724003

Kindest Regards
Iris

Hello Iris
I am pleased the RMA / Royal Marines Historical Society were able to help. Mark is a grand chap. It is always rewarding to piece together service histories of relatives (or any veteran). I wish you every success in completing your research.
Regards
Mike