Slouch Hats

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 07/02/2008 15:00:57

In most of the photos I've seen where Cdos are wearing slouch hats, they appear to be wearing puggarees

- http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-uniforms/puggaree.htm

However, the famous photo of Lt Knowland VC wearing a slouch hat, shows him with, what appears to be, a leather hat band.

Could anyone suggest what was considered correct?

Australian & NZ Forces wore their regimental badges on their slouch hats, does anyone know if the Commandos wore badges on their slouch hats?

Cheers,
Nick

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 07/02/2008 12:41:25

The Australian Army during WW2 only wore two badges on their slouch hats ever. On the turn up the Australian General Service pattern badge was worn and on the pugree (opposite side) a unit flash made from felt like material. The only exception being the Australian Light Horse who sometimes wore the general service pattern badge on the pugree.

There were many different manufacturers of slouch hats for the Australian Army and as a result the pugree that is manufactured for the hat is never of the same design. In the field some Australian troops dispensed with the pugree, or even replaced them. It is the same for the British.

In comparison with the British Army just about anything goes in regards to badges. I have seen divisional signs attached to both the pugree and the upturned peak. The key difference is the Australian NEVER wore a cap badge of the unit facing forward attached to the pugree, the British did. That does mean to say that the British just wore the cap badge there.

The Austalian Commando most certainly did wear their unit cloth patch on the pugree. Sadly the photos of British Commandos in jungle conditions on the most part show the beret being worn, or even no head gear at all.

I`m sorry but I dont believe I can answer your question, not enough photographs of slouch hat wearing commandos have been published. Understanding that other special units such as the Chindits and Airborne units did wear badges on the slouch hats we can only assume that some men did.

UnknownC,
Cheers for your reply, although I think the topic of the Slouch Hat is, in itself, quite a minefield.

The Digger History site is very interesting & informative with regards the general subject of Slouch Hats and Puggarees but, of course, I am more interested in how the commandos wore theirs.

As you'd expect with our commandos, there doesn't seem to be any hard and fast rule - some photos I've seen show the cdos wearing 'flat' rims, others wore the 'turn-up'.
Again there doesn't seem to be any pattern regarding the 'bash' in commandos' slouches.

Nick

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 09/02/2008 09:31:15

Hi All
I don't know if this helps but here is a picture of some men of 4 Troop No 1 Commando jungle training in Coconada India August 44 prior to Hill 170 action.

Several have the aforementioned head gear.

The Men are:
Back L-R V.Simmonds J.Kelly W.King R Stevens W Billham R Mewett (Dad)

Front L-R Vic Ralph A Pawson L McNelly Chah Wallah N Piglot

Quite a bunch and mixed headgear.

Regards to all

John M

Hi

Here is the photo of slouch hats from previous post.
Regards

John M

Hello John and All,
I was speaking to Vic some time back ref Slouch hats, he told me they were not prefered to the Beret for several reasons, they were cumbersome when in the Jungle and tended to catch on just about everything you didn't need them to, they were also hot as the MOD decided to put a layer of foil within the top of the hat, which of course helped reflect the sun but also had the effect of holding the heat in and over-heating the wearer's head.
Regards Ron

Thanks Ron..............yep I (we) still miss Vic.

This photo is also interesting because of the presence of a young Vic Ralph bottom left..........and of course my dad back right.

They had been having a tea break :D another common tactic apparently.

regards
John M

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 08/04/2010 15:20:06

A recent email from Douggie Neish (No 1 Cdo) in Hong Kong with photo:

Dear Geoff,

Just messing around with my computer and I came across this old photo of me and a colleague named Povey. It was taken in Bombay in 1945. Povey decided to wear his bush hat and I stuck to my green beret. The reason I am sending it is because some time ago there was a discussion in the "Forum" re green berets and "bush hats", "slouch hats". Povey is wearing the type issued to us at Wrexham before being posted overseas but I must say that they were seldom used if at all. I can't recollect what I did with my one.

Second email with details of photos:

The group seated in the doorway and wearing green berets are HQ Staff stationed at a school off the Clearwater Bay Road, Kowloon, which we occupied in the absence of any occupants in l946 I believe, or early 1947. I am not quite sure. We were firstly stationed in Murray Barracks, Garden Road, Hong Kong, then a move to Stanley Barracks and then not too many of us off to the Clearwater Bay School.

The group consists of Joe Redman our RSM, David Hill, Douggie Neish, Robert Mould, the Post Cpl ? and Thompson. The 2 local lads named Gutteres and Sun were employed by us on the clerical side.

Joe Redman is in the other photo with a horse left behind by the Japanese. I had a bareback ride on it when Joe Redman gave it a wallop and off he went with me holding on for dear life. Very sore inside legs. It came to a stop when a large hole appeared in the road. We were quite isolated there in those days with no public transport of any sort. There was an officers mess in the Sai Kung area, also off the Clearwater Bay Road, along Hirams Highway which was built by a Royal Marine Officer and still bears his name but is much larger now.

The bear-bodied group of 12 was of the HQ Staff again taken in Ahmednagar, India, in 1945.

Back Row left to right. Allsop,Dave Reid, David Hill, Douggie Neish, Dave Hewett, Bowden.
Front Row: Derek Quick, ?, Bdr Williams, Capt I.V. Carrel, Henry Brown, ?. I might have spelt some of the names wrong and those I have forgotten may eventually come back to mind.

The funeral was of one of our colleagues whose life came to a tragic end when he fell from quarters in Kowloon. I am not sure whether it was Mody Road but it was thereabouts. He was buried at Happy Valley Ceremony with full honours. I did attend and am somewhere amongst the others in the picture at the cemetery.

Other shots are of Murray Barracks where I was stationed on landing in Hong Kong on the 11th. September, 1945. 3 Commando Brigade took up Garrison duties from that date. 2nd Echelon papers would confirm further the displacement of the Brigade.(A Capt Evans name comes to mind).

Murray Barracks has long gone and replaced by high rise buildings but the main Murray Barracks Building was removed stone by stone to Stanley (HK) where it is now a tourist attraction.

There is one other photo of a young me.

Thanks for your prompt reply with up-to-date news.

Sincerely,

Douggie

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 11/04/2010 23:04:36

Here is a link to the Douggie Neish photo in the Gallery:

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/1/Douggie+Neish.jpg.html

The rest of Douggie's photos will be uploaded in due course.

nick

India 1942 see attachment

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/1/OMarah/andrew+o_marah.jpg.html

Kevin