craigab wrote:Hi everyone,

First post here at CVF. I find military kayaks fascinating and I will most certainly be picking up a copy of Quentin's book about British Military Canoes along with a new book by John Hoehn called "Commando Kayak" which deals with the development and use of the Australian designed and manufactured Mk III folboat.

I just stumbled across this thread and noticed all the angst about different types of folding kayaks used by Australian SF in WWII.

Here's the skinny on the types used by Z Special Unit / Services Reconnaissance Department / Special Operations Australia during operations such as Jaywick (successful raid on Singapore Harbour in 1944) and Rimau (unsuccessful raid on Singapore Harbour in 1943). In addition to the operational craft, there were different folding kayaks used during training as well. Other craft such as the various submersibles (MSC, Welman, Welfreighter) are a different story, so I won't cover them here. However, if you're interested in these weird and wonderful machines, check out www.welfreighter.info.

The kayaks:

Folboat -

Walter Hoehn made the non-military double and single seaters which were used during training for the Jaywick raid at X Training camp on the Hawkesbury River in NSW, but they were found to be very fragile. Both the skin and the frame were susceptible to damage due to the rocky shoreline of the training area. Despite this, they were used to great effect as Davidson and co developed Z's folboat tactics. This lead to Hoehn receiving a military order for an improved version which ultiately led to his MKIII design.

Here's what the "literature" has to say about Non-Australian Folboats:

"These may be considered a well-made craft but the materials used are sometimes faulty and every part should be minutely inspected and tested before a craft is passed for operation."

Australian kayak built by Hohn (see picture; this is NOT an American kayak !):
These were used in training at Fraser Island and Careening Bay. Used in trials at Cairns and New Guinea, but did not see operational service. Only later versions developed by Hoehn were used by Australian commandos in covert ops. Reference National Australian Archives.

Here's what the "literature" has to say about the American Kayak:

"This is a well thought-out and sturdy craft of extremely good lines and paddles exceptionally well. She is a good weight carrier with overhangs and flare at bow and stern which should make her a good performer in surf in her class. A better sea boat than the Folbot, she is not so heavy as the Mark I**."

British Mk I** canoe -

These were purposely designed as a military craft. They had a sturdier wooden frame than the Folbot or the American Kayak, and had a laminated skin made of layers of rubber and canvas with a khaki proofed linen deck and spray skirt. One important feature of the Mk I** was the inflatable sponsons which fitted into 10 foot long pockets fitted the outer hull above the waterline. These, along with the triangular inflatable flotation bags inside the bow and stern made the Mk I** almost unsinkable.

In British service, the Mk I** was usually paddled with dual paddles like a modern day kayak. Z Special Unit had rejected the use of these paddles as they were found to be fragile in the tropics and the paddling technique was considered to be less than stealthy - they were noisy (mainly from water dripping) and the phosphorescence at night was seen to be a compromise hazard. Z used these craft with Australian single paddles and found the going difficult because the paddle strokes (a-la Canadian canoe) were interfered with by the inflatable sponsons. Rather than just remove the sponsons or leave them deflated, the Z head shed decided it would be better if they had a whole new craft built to specifications... (cont.)

steve/hebbs wrote:my grandfather walter hebbs served in RME 395 detachment MNBDO and was awarded the distinguished conduct medal according to his demob papers he served from 1939 -45 was wondering if anyone has any information as its very thin on the ground at the moment
info we do have is INDIA ,BURMA possibly MALAYA
would love to know what medals he would have earned and if anyone can find out how he came to earn the distinguished conduct medal
kind regards
steve

craigab wrote:Hi everyone,

First post here at CVF. I find military kayaks fascinating and I will most certainly be picking up a copy of Quentin's book about British Military Canoes along with a new book by John Hoehn called "Commando Kayak" which deals with the development and use of the Australian designed and manufactured Mk III folboat.

I just stumbled across this thread and noticed all the angst about different types of folding kayaks used by Australian SF in WWII.

Here's the skinny on the types used by Z Special Unit / Services Reconnaissance Department / Special Operations Australia during operations such as Jaywick (successful raid on Singapore Harbour in 1944) and Rimau (unsuccessful raid on Singapore Harbour in 1943) which used Australian built MKIII folboats bult by Hohn (see National Australian Archives, bibliography reference in book: Commando Kayak. In addition to the operational craft, there were different folding kayaks used during training as well. Other craft such as the various submersibles (MSC, Welman, Welfreighter) are a different story, so I won't cover them here. However, if you're interested in these weird and wonderful machines, check out www.welfreighter.info.

The kayaks:

Folbot -

This was a civvy kayak used by Z Special mainly for training. Although called a Folbot, it appears that a variety of civilian models from Tyne to Klepper were used with Folbot being a generic term. Very early Australian Hohn double and single seaters were used during training for the Jaywick raid at X Training camp on the Hawkesbury River in NSW, but they were found to be very fragile. Both the skin and the frame were susceptible to damage due to the rocky shoreline of the training area. Despite this, they were used to great effect as Davidson and co developed Z's folboat tactics. To verify, see bibliography of National Archives Australia in book: Commando Kayak

Here's what the "literature" has to say about the Folbot:

"This may be considered a well-made craft but the materials used are sometimes faulty and every part should be minutely inspected and tested before a craft is passed for operation."

Photo here is an early Australian Hohn folboat, army designation 'Kayak Type'. Photo verified by Lt. Col. Hoare.

This is one of my dad?s early folboats supplied to Z Unit 1942. Photo taken at Fraser Island training camp showing Lt. Col. Hoare, Australian Defence Deputy Chief at rear & Maj. Moneypenny, chief instructor, FCS. who was demonstrating kneeling position to relieve stress on legs for long hauls. I met Hoare at dad?s folboat factory in 1947. See book Commando Kayak.

Here's what the "literature" has to say about American Kayaks:

"This is a well thought-out and sturdy craft of extremely good lines and paddles exceptionally well. She is a good weight carrier with overhangs and flare at bow and stern which should make her a good performer in surf in her class. A better sea boat than the Folbot, she is not so heavy as the Mark I**."

British Mk I** canoe -

These were purposely designed as a military craft. They had a sturdier wooden frame than the Folbot or the American Kayak, and had a laminated skin made of layers of rubber and canvas with a khaki proofed linen deck and spray skirt. One important feature of the Mk I** was the inflatable sponsons which fitted into 10 foot long pockets fitted the outer hull above the waterline. These, along with the triangular inflatable flotation bags inside the bow and stern made the Mk I** almost unsinkable.

In British service, the Mk I** was usually paddled with dual paddles like a modern day kayak. Z Special Unit had rejected the use of these paddles as they were found to be fragile in the tropics and the paddling technique was considered to be less than stealthy - they were noisy (mainly from water dripping) and the phosphorescence at night was seen to be a compromise hazard. Z used these craft with Australian single paddles and found the going difficult because the paddle strokes (a-la Canadian canoe) were interfered with by the inflatable sponsons. Rather than just remove the sponsons or leave them deflated, the Z head shed decided it would be better if they had a whole new craft built to specifications... (cont.)